 | Pastor Dave grew up in northern New Jersey in a very diverse cultural area. He attended Central College in Pella, Iowa received a BA in sociology and psychology. He was an offensive guard for their NCAA Div III National Championship team in 1974. In speaking for the Fellowship of Christian Athletes, he sensed a call to full time ministry. Meeting is future wife Sandy at Central, went to Michigan to finish her college while Dave started Western Seminary in Holland, Michigan. Dave married Sandy in 77 and completed his Masters of Divinity degree in 78. Pastor Dave’s first church was in Fort Lee, New Jersey, home of the George Washington Bridge. Their three children were born there and he also served as a Police and Fire Chaplain for the city. In February 1991, they came to Wichita to start Harvest Community Church. In 2006, he received his Doctor of Ministry degree from Covenant Theological (Presbyterian) Seminary in St Louis. During that year he gained a daughter-in-law with now 2 grandsons of 3 years and 6 months old. Besides Pastoring at HCC for the past 20 years, he has been Director of the SCSD & WPD Police Chaplains for 11.
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Religion
2012-10-02 14:00:35
Is heaven a lonely place with disembodied souls?
A- I don’t believe it is a lonely existence for those taken physically for several reasons. It is true as the scriptures tell us that those who died before Christ returns will be rejoined with their bodies first and then those who are still alive will join them at the second coming. {1 Thessalonians 4:16} If we follow that truth then those who are dead, have no physical bodies but are existing in the presence of the Lord according to Philippians 1:23. Now at this point I must point out that there are some things we can’t fathom because of our finite minds and we are dealing with the infinite eternal realm of God. {1 Corinthians 2:9}
We know that God is “Spirit” as Jesus shares with us in John 4:24. Jesus gives us the definition of that in one of His resurrection appearances where He says, “touch Me and see, for a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see that I have." {Luke 24:39}
Now there are illusions to God having body parts like “eyes” {1 Peter 3:12} or an “arm” {Exodus 15:16}but these are what theologians call “Anthropomorphisms” which are human figures of speech. They represent God as having human characteristics that are symbolic to help us understand how God acts and works among us. When it says God speaks, it doesn’t mean that He has vocal cords. Almighty God isn’t prevented from having audible conversation with man without vocal cords. When the Bible speaks about Him walking, it is a figure of speech of Him moving about. Seeing, he doesn’t have eyes but that He perceives. This is not hard to understand when we consider in creation where the bat sees with its hearing. As Almighty God, He can do it and is not limited even though He really doesn’t have a physical body as Jesus said by calling Him “Spirit.”
God by His very nature is “Spirit,” an incorporeal being, not limited by a certain size or shape. Just the vastness of creation would otherwise overtake Him if He was just human size. How could He maintain and control the universe? He’s omni-present or everywhere. If He were human size how could He do that? How could He maintain the control and direct the universe that is 12 billion light years across? It would be overwhelming to Him if He were shrunk to human size? But in fact, Solomon understood this before he built the physical temple, “But who is able to build a house for Him, for the heavens and the highest heavens cannot contain Him? So who am I, that I should build a house for Him, except to burn incense before Him?” {2 Chronicles 2:6} Paul conveyed this same thought in his preaching to the Pagans in Athens in Acts 17:24-25.
Now with God being Spirit, it does not keep Him from relationship with those saints who have been taken in bodily form. It didn’t keep Him from relationships with the angels{Isaiah 14:12ff}or humans on earth, {Exodus 3:4-5} Is it so with those who die in the Lord, who are in the presence of Christ Jesus, are they not communing with these and others saints who have died with or without a body? Has not their sweet fellowship begun even though they are spirit? How often we limit God’s goodness and creativity. Think about it, but how did the disciples recognize Moses and Elijah who lived centuries before the disciples at the transfiguration? The scriptures tell us we will recognize more people in the next life than we do now. {1 Corinthians 13:12}. That to be departed from this life before the final resurrection is “far better.” {2 Corinthians 5:6-8}
The scriptures testify to the existence being in a far greater level beyond what we can imagine. How could that be if there is no interaction with others? But that’s the joy it is! It is a greater experience where our connection between us and each other is God. {Revelation 21:3} How could it not be joy filled and extremely delightful? The sinful patterns of selfishness, insecurity, un-forgiveness and the like that hamper our relationships are all gone. We all then wait for the final consummation of perfection when all of earth and heaven will be made new. {21:1} That our bodies will be redeemed from decay to glorified bodies.{1 Corinthians 15:51-53} With the final consummation will come with it another level of experience because everything will be new. {Revelation 21:3} Even love and marriage will be on a whole new different plain. {Matthew 22:23-33}What wonderful things believers have to look forward to after death either before or after the final consummation of the age! Pastor Dave PS - “Now we see things imperfectly as in a cloudy mirror, but then we will see everything with perfect clarity. All that I know now is partial and incomplete, but then I will know everything completely, just as God now knows me completely.” {1 Corinthians 13:12}
